Southend_boi Posted March 26, 2015 Report Share Posted March 26, 2015 a nigga aint really been online lately but if your goal is finishing the entire game before you release it you're bound to fail in all honesty the game should of been released and updated as you progressed in development. Kai2cents 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seth Posted March 26, 2015 Author Report Share Posted March 26, 2015 It doesn't work that way. Money isn't a motivator for someone to do a good job. Money is compensation for someone who simply just does the job. There are plenty of people who slack off and get paid for it. I work with a guy who earns more than me and he literally falls asleep at his desk every single day, about 8 - 10 times a day, and begins to snore. Out of the 30ish people who are within my team, all of whom earn a paycheck, more than half of them do a shitty job. I understand this... I am just saying it is easier to get good workers when you have money, if I see someone slack I would instantly fire them and find someone who didn't slack off. If you are being paid to work, you better work. I work at Wal-mart and work very hard 99% of the time, sometimes I do take breaks when it isn't break, but it is just for a minute or two at a time. Although, the cases you listed are extreme and not something I would like to see in a person I hire for actual compensation. These people are leeches on society. It's perfectly fine to take quick breaks, I don't believe in making people work like slaves. They work worse and hate the job which makes them do the job even worse. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Feinz Posted March 26, 2015 Report Share Posted March 26, 2015 Some people have to do jobs they don't like just to make a living. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fernando Posted March 27, 2015 Report Share Posted March 27, 2015 a nigga aint really been online lately but if your goal is finishing the entire game before you release it you're bound to fail in all honesty the game should of been released and updated as you progressed in development. Kai2cents This is exactly how it should be, and I said it a long time ago, this is exactly why, in my case, my most activity periods are when the game is online and the players enjoy it, which is the only thing that motivates me to work on this besides helping Rory achieve his goals. It doesn't work that way. Money isn't a motivator for someone to do a good job. Money is compensation for someone who simply just does the job. There are plenty of people who slack off and get paid for it. I work with a guy who earns more than me and he literally falls asleep at his desk every single day, about 8 - 10 times a day, and begins to snore. Out of the 30ish people who are within my team, all of whom earn a paycheck, more than half of them do a shitty job. Nobody gets paid here, that I know, at least not me, that I do the job or not. Besides, anything that I make, takes years to be added or isn't added at all because there's other stuff to work on. And no, it doesn't work that way either, if you know you're not getting paid you won't be doing the job or won't be doing it as willingly and with the same efficiency as someone who is actually going to get paid/getting paid. Money isn't a motivator for someone to do a good job, but it is a motivator to do the job, if I were getting paid, and trust me, I fucking need the money because I'm poor as shit I starve everyday and I have my own problems which the slightest money could fix, I would work my ass off even if I didn't want to. That applies for everyone in the team. Even tho all of that isn't excuse for why the game is nearly half a year late on being hosted, as said, it needs to at least keep being hosted as we progress on it, that is how a game is developed.. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sipher Posted March 27, 2015 Report Share Posted March 27, 2015 All you did was repeat exactly what I had said in twice as many words. Regardless, the reality of the situation is that the management of the game isn't great, and this is due to inexperience. No matter what Seth, Rory, myself, or anyone wants to believe, this is a matter of fact. In any professional environment, having as little as 5 years experience isn't something to brag about. That time doing one thing doesn't automatically correlate into another completely different task either. A simple example would be having 20 years of programming experience and then being hired as a supervisor for a team of programmers, this does not correlate into 20 years of management experience. Even despite all that, the focus at this point seem to be money(even though that isn't the primary issue). Where is the steam greenlight and kickstarter that was talked about years ago? Why did that never fall through? Have you guys even considered placing advertisements on the forum for non-gold members in order to help generate income to work on the game? You guys do know that this is how a lot of free games manage to stay free, don't you? 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toirterraz Posted March 27, 2015 Report Share Posted March 27, 2015 All you did was repeat exactly what I had said in twice as many words. Regardless, the reality of the situation is that the management of the game isn't great, and this is due to inexperience. No matter what Seth, Rory, myself, or anyone wants to believe, this is a matter of fact. In any professional environment, having as little as 5 years experience isn't something to brag about. That time doing one thing doesn't automatically correlate into another completely different task either. A simple example would be having 20 years of programming experience and then being hired as a supervisor for a team of programmers, this does not correlate into 20 years of management experience. Even despite all that, the focus at this point seem to be money(even though that isn't the primary issue). Where is the steam greenlight and kickstarter that was talked about years ago? Why did that never fall through? Have you guys even considered placing advertisements on the forum for non-gold members in order to help generate income to work on the game? You guys do know that this is how a lot of free games manage to stay free, don't you? This is exactly what the problem is. I wanted to make an extended post about 3 days ago saying this in such a thorough and informal way, but I don't have the drive anymore. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
James Posted March 27, 2015 Report Share Posted March 27, 2015 I think you lot are being a bit harsh .... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sipher Posted March 27, 2015 Report Share Posted March 27, 2015 Not necessarily. I'm not telling the devs they suck, just that there is room for improvement. If a particular strategy or path isn't working, then clearly something new has to be used to reach one's goal. Personally, I think that Seth fills too many roles in the development for the game and he's burned himself out a long time ago. The Ninonline staff got extremely lucky having him on staff or this project would have died out again not even a year after it's re-announcement. That being said, he also has his weaknesses which I won't list because this isn't an attempt to make him feel bad or shame him in any way. Hell, I have my own weaknesses, but I acknowledge them and improve myself so those weaknesses no longer exist. I mention Seth a lot more than I do any other member of the staff because at this point he essentially is the staff. There isn't a large enough font size, enough bold/italics/underline or any kind of visual effect that justifies just how extremely lucky Rory is to have found Seth to keep his game alive. This of course brings out the elephant in the room regarding Rory's weaknesses as well and whether or not he's willing to accept and improve upon them. I'm sure that he knows what his weaknesses are that can or have caused setbacks whether the public knows about it or not. The defining change will be to man up and do something about it. Seth and Rory are the only two owners of the game that I acknowledge as owners at all. I think at one point there were like five of them, I don't know if that's still the case. Management of the game basically falls on their shoulders. If they're willing to take a step back and ask themselves, ok, what are we doing right, wrong, and how can we fix it? Maybe they're not even qualified to come up with a solution to an existing problem. Maybe they have to ask around for advice and opinions, then go with what makes the most sense. This is the kind of thing that should be done more often as this is how problems are resolved. I've noticed a lot of "this is what we're doing, this is what we're going to do, this is what is going to happen" only to have none of it come true or get delayed indefinitely because either the solution was shit, or it just never fell through because "meh". 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RyuOLD Posted March 27, 2015 Report Share Posted March 27, 2015 The Nin staff have acknowledged themselves that little-to-no progress is being made. I respect their sincerity. However, their focus collectively as a team needs to be ''Nin Online''. I use the term ''team'' loosely; as it seems like they're just a congregation of individuals whom have a polar opposite approach to everything they do and then expect to get results at the end of it. This debate is pointless. Conserve your energy for your fap sessions.Have faith and find other distractions in the meantime. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gendgi Posted March 27, 2015 Report Share Posted March 27, 2015 "Conserve your energy for your fap sessions" LOL sorry that was funny well... I am very new here but it seems to me that the reason people are well...more aggressive? is because they fell in love with the project and they have a passion and desire for it and to play it... So you have ppl interested in the project you have "consumers" that want it and would probably pay for it, so you probably have enough demand for your product! But the only reason i found this project was because i found one of the founders game "Fear of Unicorns?" lol so it was totally random... it appears there isn't enough WILL to fight for it? I am sorry if I am wrong and yes i know it is very hard, i am old and was in charge of several commercial teams, I know hard work and obstacles and money issues and lack of motivation but in all honesty it seems that the project isn't advertised enough? Like someone said in a previous post nowadays there are A LOT of campaigns to promote/ develop games, or whatever... and there are some shit projects being financed so..why not this? Sorry for the long text and for probably saying something wrong! In any case good luck with the project and I really hope someday it will see the light of day Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Satsugai Posted March 27, 2015 Report Share Posted March 27, 2015 On the topic of keeping the game hosted while it is being developed. Is there even enough content currently done for something like that? Last time it as available for testing there wasn't much to do and I don't think any extreme amount of progress was done afterwards. Anywho, there is definitely an issue with the ones managing the team when team members and former team members can openly criticize how things are being ran like this. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HypnoMan Posted March 29, 2015 Report Share Posted March 29, 2015 @ I can say, from personal play, that there is plenty enough content to make the game playable and with more people playing together will just make it 4x better! There is a lot to look foreword to so keep hope and keep expecting big things! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lowfy Posted March 29, 2015 Report Share Posted March 29, 2015 a nigga aint really been online lately but if your goal is finishing the entire game before you release it you're bound to fail in all honesty the game should of been released and updated as you progressed in development. Kai2cents This. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seth Posted March 29, 2015 Author Report Share Posted March 29, 2015 I have actually been making games for roughly 15 years, since I was 8. I first got into serious teams about 5 years ago, so yes you are right about that. But that isn't the point, I understand people like motivation and enthusiast work environments, I am not able to make that happen with such a limited budget. It should be enough that you're making a game you want to see become reality, I shouldn't have to babysit people and make them want to work. I tried doing that, but it is really difficult cause it burns me out faster. Working a job is a responsibility, you work and do a good job cause you have integrity not that you enjoy the job, but if you got the job do the job and don't be a waste of space. Working at Wal-mart sucks, I unload trucks for $7.65/hr, I don't do it for the money, I wanted the experience in the real world - yes I am a very geeky person who loves my cave. It's mind over matter, today I worked for 11 hours - and I didn't bitch or stop once. I worked my ass off, cause it makes me a better person and not a lazy good for nothing. I am aware of my weaknesses, no better than any of you. My skill is just game development, I am not here to talk above anyone or act like I am better - when in the scope of real life not in the scope of the game decisions. The main problem here is, I wanted to organize my own life and took a step back from the project, to recover and improve myself. This is why the game hasn't had much updates on my end in a long time, I have done lots of bug fixes and optimizations, but as for features not very many. It's tough making a game, but like I said - I finish what I start even if it takes a long time. At-least it won't be abandoned, and @Rory has been working on the game again. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ueda Posted March 29, 2015 Report Share Posted March 29, 2015 He speaks da truth 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sipher Posted March 29, 2015 Report Share Posted March 29, 2015 If you're placing improvement upon your own life before Ninonline, then that's great to hear. Development of the game should come second to improving your own quality of life. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gendgi Posted March 29, 2015 Report Share Posted March 29, 2015 Anyways take your time guys, I will support in what I can! and surely be here when it launches Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
James Posted March 29, 2015 Report Share Posted March 29, 2015 He speaks da truth Shows us the magic Rory Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Angelus Posted March 29, 2015 Report Share Posted March 29, 2015 New name to the forum, yet have remembered waiting for this game for some time now.. There should be enough content for people to play. According to staff members there is enough content to play..why is there no playing happening? Alpha is just that...alpha..the beginning. Best chance of the game improving is with the community playing it because you get our earnest input collectively and that's if you care about our input(sometimes you shouldn't). The staff would have less complaints about shit not being done with the game being hosted so they can take a load off, and players have the game they've been wanting to play. It's a win win situation, so stop losing and win. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HypnoMan Posted March 29, 2015 Report Share Posted March 29, 2015 @Sipher I agree completely, at the end of the day the game is just codes that mean nothing. Its why I laugh at people who rage at games and make death threats XD its stupid. Yes i get mad when someone chases me down for 20 minuets to kill me in Reign of Kings -_- but i wont break my keyboard for it @Everyone The game will be amazing I Know this it just needs a bit more time, I can smell Alpha coming. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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